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if it's not clear how their mouth works, here is RL footage of an elderly one that manages to catch live prey with only 3 of it's remaining teeth

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This post has been edited by Papainmanis: Dec 7 2021, 08:04 PM

the diet section doesn't state Carnivore: then the actual species

QUOTE (SpeedTowel @ Dec 8 2021, 09:01 PM)

the diet section doesn't state Carnivore: then the actual species

Thanks, fixed.

This is a very nice critter, I thought they were gonna be bigger.

So they have heat pits, I'm curious of the structure of these, though the detail may not be entirely necessary I am always curious about more and more elaboration.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infrared_sensing_in_snakes

It brings back the thought about the visual experience of the sauceback lineage, of which they don't have one. Disgustedorite had chittered at me about my own Saucebacks as one of the first things we discussed together, and I had a similar reaction; whatever stimulus these organs relay probably go to their echolocation brain center (or maybe scent center, but less likely) where it would be translated, there wouldn't all at once be a visual center popping up in the brain. That would probably have to occur in the next descendent if it's even necessary to differentiate between the two. I don't think it would be, otherwise snakes would have distinguished it I think.

The conscious mind inside would probably find it more useful as an addition to their current understanding of the world rather than a brand new experience. Though if it weren't part of the echolocation center it could be just a "gut feeling" for them rather than such an extreme conscious experience like vision for us. It could be like blind sight.

I find the rail system curious. It's slightly difficult for me to understand, but it sounds like the top of the femur has multiple sockets it can rest in, like a racheting thing. This makes me wonder about joint cushioning, do Saucebacks have cartilage between their bones.
I personally think a simplified diagram of the femur shifting would help, though the description works okay.

I like how cooperative and caring they are with one another.

QUOTE (colddigger @ Dec 10 2021, 06:04 PM)

This is a very nice critter, I thought they were gonna be bigger. So they have heat pits, I'm curious of the structure of these, though the detail may not be entirely necessary I am always curious about more and more elaboration. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infrared_sensing_in_snakes It brings back the thought about the visual experience of the sauceback lineage, of which they don't have one. Disgustedorite had chittered at me about my own Saucebacks as one of the first things we discussed together, and I had a similar reaction; whatever stimulus these organs relay probably go to their echolocation brain center (or maybe scent center, but less likely) where it would be translated, there wouldn't all at once be a visual center popping up in the brain. That would probably have to occur in the next descendent if it's even necessary to differentiate between the two. I don't think it would be, otherwise snakes would have distinguished it I think. The conscious mind inside would probably find it more useful as an addition to their current understanding of the world rather than a brand new experience. Though if it weren't part of the echolocation center it could be just a "gut feeling" for them rather than such an extreme conscious experience like vision for us. It could be like blind sight.

I imagine they are lined up with heat receptors along the ridges leading into the pit as well as within the pits themselves, I am not sure how that would mix and combine with the chemoreceptors up close.

This is a very vague early notion of what their perception is:


But I think even that is probably inaccurate, and doesn't represent what they experience any more then a map of color cone pixels would represent our experience of the world. Given that saucebacks have being blind persuit predators for a very long time, their mental map would be comprised of mental associations between scent, sounds, sound reflection and their memories and expectation of whatever it is they recognize and the heat source they think represents it. While it might not be strictly speaking a visual image, it would be a spatial mental image, and probably as detailed as color is for us. That has some interesting implications - saucebacks have an imagination built right into the foundations of their cognition.

This does mean the mental image is the interpretation within the brain, and is probably niot formed until associations can produce it. This could explain why they are so resistent to cephalization. Thopugh in the songpiper - one of my other saucebacks - I took that in the opposite route, with the mental image already being combined and interpreted on the way to the brain.

QUOTE (colddigger @ Dec 10 2021, 06:04 PM)

I find the rail system curious. It's slightly difficult for me to understand, but it sounds like the top of the femur has multiple sockets it can rest in, like a racheting thing. This makes me wonder about joint cushioning, do Saucebacks have cartilage between their bones. I personally think a simplified diagram of the femur shifting would help, though the description works okay.

The railing is one long socket that stretches under the sauce, imagin the railing on a sliding door. it would need a web of ligaments with offshots that attach all along the rail, and muscles pushing or pulling it along the rail. In rest they just let the socket slide up to the back edge of the rail, letting the body slope down.

Maybe... IDK. Initially i was very diagram reliant, I am trying to shift in the opposite direction and try to do the best one shot to capture the ideas conveyed in the species, even if it takes a few dozen iterations. Ideally someone should be able to see this in the generation list of creatures and think "Oh a sauceback with a hip rail lets play with that!"

QUOTE (colddigger @ Dec 10 2021, 06:04 PM)

I like how cooperative and caring they are with one another.

I thought it was important if I want to introduce risky behaviors for collective benefits, and I like the juxtaposition to have predators that feast on their prey alive like wild dogs be compassionate towards one another.

Update: a pack of saucebows is now a brigade, and their communal nest is now a brigadier.

Why has the tail become shorter than their ancestors? Wouldn't a longer tail mean larger muscles that can be attached to the thighs and thus power their stride? Also, I feel like the teeth should not be external 100% of the time, I would instead reference the Argusraptors and their ability to extend their teeth out of their mouths.

"tearing large chunks of flash with their teeth," There is a typo here, it should be 'flesh"

I would think a broader tail would allow for expansion on muscle attachments that already exist as opposed to a longer tail needing to create new attachments.

To clarify: they are 90cms long, their ancestors are 80cm Long, with most of the difference being in the torso. The tails are about the same length as the ancestor, but more mascular at the base.

I believe the misinterpretionn is a visual illusion. As described, their main adaptation is the elongation of the pillar erect "socket" rims into railing, thus allowing the base of the leg to swing back and forth along it, which is why the right leg is pushed forward while the left leg is pulled backwards. The later covers the back area of the torso that would otherwise look like an extension of the tail.

Is there a reason the spiracles are so large?

Given their taller and flatter fan, they'd need larger spiracles to maintain the same internal volume of captured air. In this case the volume of air should be slightly higher, but not by much.

Approval Checklist:
Art:
Art Present?: Y
Art clear?: Y
Gen number?: Y
All limbs shown?: Y
Reasonably Comparable to Ancestor?: Y
Realistic additions?: Y

Name:
Binomial Taxonomic Name?: Y
Creator?: Y

Ancestor:
Listed?: Y
What changes?:

• External?: Feather crest, Enlarged nostrils
• Internal?: Nostril nerves, hip socket
• Behavioral/Mental?:

Are Changes Realistic?: Y
New Genus Needed?: Y (Done)

Habitat:
Type?: 2/2
Flavor?: 2/3
Connected?: Y
Wildcard?: N

Size:
Same as Ancestor?: N
Within range?: Y
Exception?: N/A

Support:
Same as Ancestor?: Y
Reasonable changes (if any)?: Y
Other?: N/A

Diet:
Same as Ancestor?: Y
Transition Rule?: NA
Reasonable changes (if any)?: Y

Respiration:
Same as Ancestor?: Y
Does It Fit Habitat?: Y
Reasonable changes (if any)?: N/A
Other?: N/A

Thermoregulation:
Same as Ancestor?: Y
Does It Fit Habitat?: Y
Reasonable changes (if any)?: N/A
Other?: N/A

Reproduction:
Same as Ancestor?: Y
Does It Fit Habitat?: Y
Reasonable changes (if any)?: N/A
Other?: N/A

Description:
Length?: Good
Capitalized correctly?: Y
Replace/Split from ancestor?: Split
Other?: NA

Opinion: Approved